July 2001 - Ag-tech - mailman3.cels.anl.gov

RE: [AG-TECH] New Gentner Software
by Markus Buchhorn 26 Jul '01

26 Jul '01

At 05:52 PM 26/07/2001 -0700, Jay Beavers wrote: >We've been asked to consider a web management interface to each of the >Windows XP nodes for use by network technicans et al who we don't want >to give remote desktop capabilities to but who need to be able to >monitor diagnostic status and adjust settings on an individual node >basis. That's high on our priority list. Great to hear it - that'll be very useful. The remote desktop approach (also achievable with vnc) does little to unify the UI of all the various bits and pieces (to suit the apps suite of the hour :-) ), even if they are all running on the one system. I suspect it also does not readily allow multiple operators to manage different aspects of the one node. Plus there's the resourcing issue (running to Bob's wireless laptop or PDA :-) ). >I spent the time >during setup to properly secure them and spend a few minutes each week >checking logs and checking for security related patches. Hear, hear. Cheers, Markus Markus Buchhorn, Faculty of Engineering and IT, | Ph: +61 2 61258810 email: markus.buchhorn(a)anu.edu.au, mail: CSIT Bldg #108 |Fax: +61 2 61259805 Australian National University, Canberra 0200, Australia |Mobile: 0417 281429

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RE: [AG-TECH] New Gentner Software
by Jay Beavers 26 Jul '01

26 Jul '01

I control all of my Windows XP based nodes over the network today, including all A/V settings as well as adjusting my network diagnostic tools to suit the network situation of the hour ;-) I do this using Remote Desktop / Remote Administration which is an integral feature to Windows XP / Windows 2000. We've been asked to consider a web management interface to each of the Windows XP nodes for use by network technicans et al who we don't want to give remote desktop capabilities to but who need to be able to monitor diagnostic status and adjust settings on an individual node basis. That's high on our priority list. Regarding the security comment, I've run Windows NT et al, Linux, and BSD boxes on the net in production capacity since 1994 and have never had a box on any OS compromised in any way because I spent the time during setup to properly secure them and spend a few minutes each week checking logs and checking for security related patches. - jcb -----Original Message----- From: Markus Buchhorn [mailto:[email protected]] Sent: Thursday, July 26, 2001 4:52 PM To: Robert Olson Cc: Don Morton; ag-tech(a)mcs.anl.gov Subject: Re: [AG-TECH] New Gentner Software Well, if we're adding wishes to this list... :-) Allow this control application to run over the network, so that one operator can manage multiple nodes, or a remote operator can manage a given node. At first blush, a web browser would make a very nice harness for this. Perhaps implement as Apache modules? (apologies to Jay ;-) ). Save you having to develop at both ends of the network pipe (as with e.g. a Java applet). If it's lean enough, it could be driven from a PDA :-) Jay - can you put some hooks into your pending A/V application (the one with the misshapen playback buffers ;-) ) that would allow it to be controlled remotely? We could also pick up some of the hacks that allow you to drive the various PTZ cameras through a web page. It could also hook into monitoring/logging systems... Cheers, Markus At 06:23 PM 26/07/2001 -0500, Robert Olson wrote: >That's precisely what I'm thinking. Audio levels & control available >per-mic, aggregate outgoing, aggregate incoming, and per-site incoming; >fine tuning of video, placement, etc etc. > >--bob > >At 05:21 PM 7/26/2001 -0600, Don Morton wrote: >>Bob Olson wrote: >> > >> > That would be a great thing if someone wanted to do it. It's not >> > hard, just a fairly large amount of detail to cope with to get it >> > useful & right. There are other reasons for doing just htat, >> > including enabling hte creation of a unified control panel >> > application. >> >> >>Am I reading this correctly? Are you envisioning a single control >>panel for vic, rat, gentner, etc., all to maybe run on control >>machine? Strikes me as a wonderful thought (if that's what you were >>thinking) and maybe something I might want to add into my Research >>Experience for Undergraduates proposal (the other thing is a >>distributed PDF viewer so we're not restricted to Power Point in our >>presentations). Markus Buchhorn, Faculty of Engineering and IT, | Ph: +61 2 61258810 email: markus.buchhorn(a)anu.edu.au, mail: CSIT Bldg #108 |Fax: +61 2 61259805 Australian National University, Canberra 0200, Australia |Mobile: 0417 281429

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Re: [AG-TECH] New Gentner Software
by Robert Olson 26 Jul '01

26 Jul '01

At 09:52 AM 7/27/2001 +1000, Markus Buchhorn wrote: >Well, if we're adding wishes to this list... :-) > >Allow this control application to run over the network, so that one >operator can manage multiple nodes, or a remote operator can manage a >given node. Oh definitely -- so that I can also control the node from my laptop while sitting on the couch :-) >At first blush, a web browser would make a very nice harness for this. >Perhaps implement as Apache modules? (apologies to Jay ;-) ). Save you >having to develop at both ends of the network pipe (as with e.g. a Java >applet). I'm thinking the architectecture would have some number of agents connected to the actual devices (gentner, PTZ camera, remote-controllable apps) that speak a common interface (XMLRPC maybe) via some published API. The API would include mechanisms for authorization and authentication so that control would be exported only to those a site wanted to allow control. Given that web servers then can speak XMLRPC (there exist client libs for PHP & perl/mod_perl...) an apache backend could speak to those. A custom client could also be built, speaking to the same XMLRPC agents. >We could also pick up some of the hacks that allow you to drive the >various PTZ cameras through a web page. It could also hook into >monitoring/logging systems... Yup. The LBL folks already have a daemon that will run the Canon & Sony ptz cameras. It doesn't speak XMLRPC, but it could be modified to do so or a translation agent built. --bob

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Re: [AG-TECH] New Gentner Software
by Bob Huebert 26 Jul '01

26 Jul '01

At 5:21 PM -0600 7/26/01, Don Morton wrote: >Bob Olson wrote: >> >> That would be a great thing if someone wanted to do it. It's not hard, >> just a fairly large amount of detail to cope with to get it useful & >> right. There are other reasons for doing just htat, including enabling hte >> creation of a unified control panel application. > > >Am I reading this correctly? Are you envisioning a single control panel >for vic, rat, gentner, etc., all to maybe run on control machine? >Strikes me as a wonderful thought (if that's what you were thinking) >and maybe something I might want to add into my Research Experience >for Undergraduates proposal (the other thing is a distributed PDF >viewer so we're not restricted to Power Point in our presentations). Rolling everything into a single bow would be a great simplification. What about loading of the machine? I haven't seen any problems with the linux boxes wrt loading, but the Windows boxes have been problematic. I suspect this to be an issue with the OS and would *love* to see the AGN community get away from the proprietary PPT and create a more friendly Opensource environment. Removal of the Microsoft OS' would definitely help our security folks sleep easier.... :-) -bobh -- _______________________________________________________________________ Bob Huebert email: huebert(a)arsc.edu HPC Visualization Systems Analyst voice: (907) 474-5751 Arctic Region Supercomputing Center FAX: (907) 474-5494 University of Alaska Fairbanks WWW: http://www.arsc.edu/

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Re: [AG-TECH] New Gentner Software
by Markus Buchhorn 26 Jul '01

26 Jul '01

Well, if we're adding wishes to this list... :-) Allow this control application to run over the network, so that one operator can manage multiple nodes, or a remote operator can manage a given node. At first blush, a web browser would make a very nice harness for this. Perhaps implement as Apache modules? (apologies to Jay ;-) ). Save you having to develop at both ends of the network pipe (as with e.g. a Java applet). If it's lean enough, it could be driven from a PDA :-) Jay - can you put some hooks into your pending A/V application (the one with the misshapen playback buffers ;-) ) that would allow it to be controlled remotely? We could also pick up some of the hacks that allow you to drive the various PTZ cameras through a web page. It could also hook into monitoring/logging systems... Cheers, Markus At 06:23 PM 26/07/2001 -0500, Robert Olson wrote: >That's precisely what I'm thinking. Audio levels & control available >per-mic, aggregate outgoing, aggregate incoming, and per-site incoming; >fine tuning of video, placement, etc etc. > >--bob > >At 05:21 PM 7/26/2001 -0600, Don Morton wrote: >>Bob Olson wrote: >> > >> > That would be a great thing if someone wanted to do it. It's not hard, >> > just a fairly large amount of detail to cope with to get it useful & >> > right. There are other reasons for doing just htat, including enabling hte >> > creation of a unified control panel application. >> >> >>Am I reading this correctly? Are you envisioning a single control panel >>for vic, rat, gentner, etc., all to maybe run on control machine? >>Strikes me as a wonderful thought (if that's what you were thinking) >>and maybe something I might want to add into my Research Experience >>for Undergraduates proposal (the other thing is a distributed PDF >>viewer so we're not restricted to Power Point in our presentations). Markus Buchhorn, Faculty of Engineering and IT, | Ph: +61 2 61258810 email: markus.buchhorn(a)anu.edu.au, mail: CSIT Bldg #108 |Fax: +61 2 61259805 Australian National University, Canberra 0200, Australia |Mobile: 0417 281429

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Re: [AG-TECH] New Gentner Software
by Ravikiran Madduri 26 Jul '01

26 Jul '01

sounds interesting.Please let me know if i can contribute any thing to this --Ravi On Thu, 26 Jul 2001, Robert Olson wrote: > That's precisely what I'm thinking. Audio levels & control available > per-mic, aggregate outgoing, aggregate incoming, and per-site incoming; > fine tuning of video, placement, etc etc. > > --bob > > At 05:21 PM 7/26/2001 -0600, Don Morton wrote: > >Bob Olson wrote: > > > > > > That would be a great thing if someone wanted to do it. It's not hard, > > > just a fairly large amount of detail to cope with to get it useful & > > > right. There are other reasons for doing just htat, including enabling hte > > > creation of a unified control panel application. > > > > > >Am I reading this correctly? Are you envisioning a single control panel > >for vic, rat, gentner, etc., all to maybe run on control machine? > >Strikes me as a wonderful thought (if that's what you were thinking) > >and maybe something I might want to add into my Research Experience > >for Undergraduates proposal (the other thing is a distributed PDF > >viewer so we're not restricted to Power Point in our presentations). > >

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Re: [AG-TECH] New Gentner Software
by Don Morton 26 Jul '01

26 Jul '01

I'm teaching a 500-level Adv. Operating Systems this spring, and have a fair amount of leeway in the material - I typically try to emphasise distributed computing - I wonder if something like this could fit in, at least as a prototype. Emphasis on portability..... seems like a bit of a bear to distribute control of vic and rat but, if we in the class worry more about getting control signals between the various machines, and someone else worries about getting them "into" the application, it just might be interesting. Robert Olson wrote: > > That's precisely what I'm thinking. Audio levels & control available > per-mic, aggregate outgoing, aggregate incoming, and per-site incoming; > fine tuning of video, placement, etc etc. > > --bob > > At 05:21 PM 7/26/2001 -0600, Don Morton wrote: > >Bob Olson wrote: > > > > > > That would be a great thing if someone wanted to do it. It's not hard, > > > just a fairly large amount of detail to cope with to get it useful & > > > right. There are other reasons for doing just htat, including enabling hte > > > creation of a unified control panel application. > > > > > >Am I reading this correctly? Are you envisioning a single control panel > >for vic, rat, gentner, etc., all to maybe run on control machine? > >Strikes me as a wonderful thought (if that's what you were thinking) > >and maybe something I might want to add into my Research Experience > >for Undergraduates proposal (the other thing is a distributed PDF > >viewer so we're not restricted to Power Point in our presentations).

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Re: [AG-TECH] New Gentner Software
by Robert Olson 26 Jul '01

26 Jul '01

That's precisely what I'm thinking. Audio levels & control available per-mic, aggregate outgoing, aggregate incoming, and per-site incoming; fine tuning of video, placement, etc etc. --bob At 05:21 PM 7/26/2001 -0600, Don Morton wrote: >Bob Olson wrote: > > > > That would be a great thing if someone wanted to do it. It's not hard, > > just a fairly large amount of detail to cope with to get it useful & > > right. There are other reasons for doing just htat, including enabling hte > > creation of a unified control panel application. > > >Am I reading this correctly? Are you envisioning a single control panel >for vic, rat, gentner, etc., all to maybe run on control machine? >Strikes me as a wonderful thought (if that's what you were thinking) >and maybe something I might want to add into my Research Experience >for Undergraduates proposal (the other thing is a distributed PDF >viewer so we're not restricted to Power Point in our presentations).

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Re: [AG-TECH] New Gentner Software
by Don Morton 26 Jul '01

26 Jul '01

Bob Olson wrote: > > That would be a great thing if someone wanted to do it. It's not hard, > just a fairly large amount of detail to cope with to get it useful & > right. There are other reasons for doing just htat, including enabling hte > creation of a unified control panel application. Am I reading this correctly? Are you envisioning a single control panel for vic, rat, gentner, etc., all to maybe run on control machine? Strikes me as a wonderful thought (if that's what you were thinking) and maybe something I might want to add into my Research Experience for Undergraduates proposal (the other thing is a distributed PDF viewer so we're not restricted to Power Point in our presentations).

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RE: [AG-TECH] New Gentner Software
by Bob Olson 26 Jul '01

26 Jul '01

That would be a great thing if someone wanted to do it. It's not hard, just a fairly large amount of detail to cope with to get it useful & right. There are other reasons for doing just htat, including enabling hte creation of a unified control panel application. --bob On Thu, 26 Jul 2001, Jay Beavers wrote: > Ya know, all the Gentner software is doing is sending a series of text > commands through a serial port. > > With all the inconveniences we keep seeing with the software (OS > incompatibility, CPU utilization, UI overload), I wonder if it might be > useful to clearly articulate exactly what it is we need the software to > do and then use a simple UI program developed in spec with the very well > documented serial protocol to create an AG specific Gentner control > program. > > - jcb > > -----Original Message----- > From: Robert Olson [mailto:[email protected]] > Sent: Monday, July 23, 2001 9:28 AM > To: Bill Nickless > Cc: Mustafa Varank; ag-tech(a)mcs.anl.gov > Subject: Re: [AG-TECH] New Gentner Software > > > I also did a brief test of manually changing hte priority from the task > mgr. Didn't seem to have an effect on the operation of the gentner > software. Haven't tried with the ag video up. > > Still worry about function overload on the display machine console... > > --bob > > At 11:24 AM 7/23/2001 -0500, Bill Nickless wrote: > >At 10:50 AM 7/23/2001 -0500, Robert Olson wrote: > >>NOte that both Gware and APware will consume 100% cpu even in an idle > >>state. We've not tested yet to see if this has a bad effect on other > >>things happening on the display box, but it seems it can't be good. > >>Current thinking is to perhaps move to Win2k on the control machine, > so > >>we can run other network services there as well. > > > >The good news about Windows 2000 is that you can set the process > >priority > >of an application at start time. I've had very good success running > >things like MP3 encoders at LOW (IDLE) priority and continuing to do > other > >things on the system. > > > >This should work really well on a display machine with two > >processors. Last I heard, vic wasn't multithreaded so could only > saturate > >one processor. > > > >Here are the details on the start command: > > > >C:\>start /? > >Starts a separate window to run a specified program or command. > > > >START ["title"] [/Dpath] [/I] [/MIN] [/MAX] [/SEPARATE | /SHARED] > > [/LOW | /NORMAL | /HIGH | /REALTIME | /ABOVENORMAL | > /BELOWNORMAL] > > [/WAIT] [/B] [command/program] > > [parameters] > > > > "title" Title to display in window title bar. > > path Starting directory > > B Start application without creating a new window. The > > application has ^C handling ignored. Unless the > application > > enables ^C processing, ^Break is the only way to > interrupt > > the application > > I The new environment will be the original environment > passed > > to the cmd.exe and not the current environment. > > MIN Start window minimized > > MAX Start window maximized > > SEPARATE Start 16-bit Windows program in separate memory space > > SHARED Start 16-bit Windows program in shared memory space > > LOW Start application in the IDLE priority class > > NORMAL Start application in the NORMAL priority class > > HIGH Start application in the HIGH priority class > > REALTIME Start application in the REALTIME priority class > > ABOVENORMAL Start application in the ABOVENORMAL priority class > > BELOWNORMAL Start application in the BELOWNORMAL priority class > > WAIT Start application and wait for it to terminate > > command/program > > If it is an internal cmd command or a batch file then > > the command processor is run with the /K switch to > cmd.exe. > > This means that the window will remain after the > command > > has been run. > > > > If it is not an internal cmd command or batch file > then > > it is a program and will run as either a windowed > application > > or a console application. > > > > parameters These are the parameters passed to the command/program > > > > > >If Command Extensions are enabled, external command invocation through > >the command line or the START command changes as follows: > > > >non-executable files may be invoked through their file association just > > by typing the name of the file as a command. (e.g. WORD.DOC > would > > launch the application associated with the .DOC file extension). > > See the ASSOC and FTYPE commands for how to create these > > associations from within a command script. > > > >When executing an application that is a 32-bit GUI application, CMD.EXE > > does not wait for the application to terminate before returning to > > the command prompt. This new behavior does NOT occur if executing > > within a command script. > > > >When executing a command line whose first token is the string "CMD " > > without an extension or path qualifier, then "CMD" is replaced > with > > the value of the COMSPEC variable. This prevents picking up > CMD.EXE > > from the current directory. > > > >When executing a command line whose first token does NOT contain an > > extension, then CMD.EXE uses the value of the PATHEXT > > environment variable to determine which extensions to look for > > and in what order. The default value for the PATHEXT variable > > is: > > > > .COM;.EXE;.BAT;.CMD > > > > Notice the syntax is the same as the PATH variable, with > > semicolons separating the different elements. > > > >When searching for an executable, if there is no match on any > >extension, then looks to see if the name matches a directory name. If > >it does, the START command launches the Explorer on that path. If done > > >from the command line, it is the equivalent to doing a CD /D to that > >path. > > > > > >=== > >Bill Nickless http://www.mcs.anl.gov/people/nickless +1 630 252 > 7390 > >PGP:0E 0F 16 80 C5 B1 69 52 E1 44 1A A5 0E 1B 74 F7 > nickless(a)mcs.anl.gov > >

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